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Post by Sonnington on May 18, 2017 0:41:18 GMT
I'm actually surprised that Virtua Fighter 2 came out the least favourable. You learn something new everyday. Only 15 votes anyway. Either way, Fighting Vipers is much more of a casual fighting game. It's understandable it comes out on top on these kind of poles ^ Yeah, true. Insofar. I love me some VF4 Evo and VF5, and I -want- to like Virtua Fighter 2. I know the combos, but there's something about it. I guess it feels kinda slow and floaty? While Fighter Vipers feels quick and satisfying? I'm far from being "into" fighters, but I've spent my fair share of time with them on Saturn.
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dantemdie
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Post by dantemdie on May 18, 2017 8:18:55 GMT
I actually feel Fighting Vipers is slower paced. VF2 is just much more technical. To be proficient in VF (in general) isn't an easy task at all so it feels a bit slower but, in fact, the problem is with the player and not the game : p
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sych
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Post by sych on May 18, 2017 11:43:31 GMT
Only 15 votes anyway. Either way, Fighting Vipers is much more of a casual fighting game. It's understandable it comes out on top on these kind of poles[/quote] I actually feel Fighting Vipers is slower paced. VF2 is just much more technical. To be proficient in VF (in general) isn't an easy task at all so it feels a bit slower but, in fact, the problem is with the player and not the game : p Fighting Vipers is anthing but a casual fighting game. VF2 is definitley more casual and slower paced than Fighting Vipers. There's too much arse kissing when it comes to VF2. Some of it is warranted but alot of it is without merit. I would actually consider VF2 to be the less technical of the two. A button basher could actually win matches on VF2 but on FV it's less possible as the FV characters have combo blockers so the gameplay becomes very technical. For example the art of blocking is much more important in Fighting Vipers than it is in VF2. Knowing which moves devastate your opponenets armour more is also a technical feat and then working out which chartacters rely more on the upper section or lower section of their body for their stength is also another technical feat. For example it requires a whole different mentality and method of play when fighting against someone like Grace to Picky. Grace carries most of her strength and weaknesses in her lower body section, mainly her legs where her devasting rollerskating kicks can be a serious pain. So an imformed choice is made to attack the leg department. Not only working out which moves your character has to cause maximum devastation to her legs but also being knowledgable of Graces own move set and knowing which of her attacks leave her legs vunreable. With Picky its all about getting rid of that annoying Skateboard as it has extensive reach, located on the back of his upper body so new tactic comes in play. Knowing when to block is even more important when fighting someone like Picky. For example when Picky finishes a punch combo he'll usually end with some form of a skateboard smash which is the time to block because if unconnected, Picky's skateboard becomes exposed which means you can target it. Also after being floored by Picky, playing dead is another great tactic as he'll usually go in for a body splash and that's the time to roll out of the way before he connects. If done successfully you stand behind Picky, with Picky infront slowly recovering from the missed body splash with his skate board in perfect position ready to be pounded on. And there's a huge reward from getting rid of your opponents armour as the next round they have to fight without it, making their assualt weaker. Instant payoff right there. It's things like that make Fighting Vipers more technical than VF2. If I'm playing VF2 I know I'll attack Sarah, Jacky, Lau, Lion and Shun exactly the same way to achieve the same success. It's only when playing countering Akira and cheating Dural that I have to change up my tactics. But that's mainly down to the AI not fighting fairly. Even though I picked Virtual On my second choice probably would have been Fighting Vipers. VF2 is also technical and great to play but there is more incentive and payoff through doing the grind on Fightin Vipers. VF2 not so much imo.
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Post by bultje112 on May 18, 2017 11:56:18 GMT
no way. fighting vipers is way more casual. virtua fighter 2 is a hardcore game. only those who invest so much time in one character gets to master it. I suggest you look up on youtube a video of yu suzuki schooling the creator of tekken in both tekken and virtua fighter. check his virtua fighter skills. I've played these games for countless hours and have never mastered them and I don't particularly suck at games.
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sych
"Living for the fantasy" -NIGHTS INTO DREAMS- The Classic Saturn Gem!!!
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Post by sych on May 18, 2017 12:07:28 GMT
no way. fighting vipers is way more casual. virtua fighter 2 is a hardcore game. only those who invest so much time in one character gets to master it. I suggest you look up on youtube a video of yu suzuki schooling the creator of tekken in both tekken and virtua fighter. check his virtua fighter skills. I've played these games for countless hours and have never mastered them and I don't particularly suck at games. You could say the same about any creator and their game. You're always gonna see a higher level of play because it's their creation. The creator is always going to be more techincal at their own game, not just where VF2 is concerned but for any fighting game. I can quite easily beat VF2 in Arcade Mode with a number characters. It's not rocket science. This notion that its somehow in a world of its own when it comes to indepth technicality compared to other 3D Fighters is a notion that I've never bought. As good as VF2 is it can't compete with Tekken.
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dantemdie
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Post by dantemdie on May 18, 2017 12:37:03 GMT
Only 15 votes anyway. Either way, Fighting Vipers is much more of a casual fighting game. It's understandable it comes out on top on these kind of poles I actually feel Fighting Vipers is slower paced. VF2 is just much more technical. To be proficient in VF (in general) isn't an easy task at all so it feels a bit slower but, in fact, the problem is with the player and not the game : p It's things like that make Fighting Vipers more technical than VF2. If I'm playing VF2 I know I'll attack Sarah, Jacky, Lau, Lion and Shun exactly the same way to achieve the same success. It's only when playing countering Akira and cheating Dural that I have to change up my tactics. But that's mainly down to the AI not fighting fairly. [/quote] Don't take it in the wrong way, but this statement is screaming "casual" gamer - and that's just fine. The only way you'll have success in Virtua Fighter (in general, not only the 2nd) is adapting to the various match-ups. Sure, if you play solo or agains't a couple of friends you might feel everything works in the same way as opposed to Fighting Vipers. Meaning: Fighting Vipers has a better AI (eventually) and the use of weapons might feel like it's easier to interpret what's happening on screen. For ages, Virtua Fighter franchise was the most technical 3D fighting game's franchise and everything just used VF2 concepts in order to create new IPs or adapting existing ones. Even Tekken eventually started using Virtua Fighter's juggling properties to perform combos (not those "10-hit combos" you could find in the command list - i'm talking about TRUE combos). I could go on and on and on... I've been entering fighting games tournaments since i was 19 (i'm 27 now), i've met hundreds of players, travelled abroad just to enter in tournaments and only a tiny little fraction played Virtua Fighter competitively due to its complexity.
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Post by bultje112 on May 18, 2017 12:45:48 GMT
no way. fighting vipers is way more casual. virtua fighter 2 is a hardcore game. only those who invest so much time in one character gets to master it. I suggest you look up on youtube a video of yu suzuki schooling the creator of tekken in both tekken and virtua fighter. check his virtua fighter skills. I've played these games for countless hours and have never mastered them and I don't particularly suck at games. You could say the same about any creator and their game. You're always gonna see a higher level of play because it's their creation. The creator is always going to be more techincal at their own game, not just where VF2 is concerned but for any fighting game. I can quite easily beat VF2 in Arcade Mode with a number characters. It's not rocket science. This notion that its somehow in a world of its own when it comes to indepth technicality compared to other 3D Fighters is a notion that I've never bought. As good as VF2 is it can't compete with Tekken. the thing is in fighting vipers. anyone could pick up the controller and be able to win battles. in virtua fighter 2 any noob will get schooled by cpu and experienced players.
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sych
"Living for the fantasy" -NIGHTS INTO DREAMS- The Classic Saturn Gem!!!
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Post by sych on May 18, 2017 13:32:17 GMT
You could say the same about any creator and their game. You're always gonna see a higher level of play because it's their creation. The creator is always going to be more techincal at their own game, not just where VF2 is concerned but for any fighting game. I can quite easily beat VF2 in Arcade Mode with a number characters. It's not rocket science. This notion that its somehow in a world of its own when it comes to indepth technicality compared to other 3D Fighters is a notion that I've never bought. As good as VF2 is it can't compete with Tekken. the thing is in fighting vipers. anyone could pick up the controller and be able to win battles. in virtua fighter 2 any noob will get schooled by cpu and experienced players. But that's the thing. It is actually the exact opposite. Button bashers and noobs will and can easily win battles on VF2 because the game mechanics allow for it. You can't get away with winning via fluke on Fighting Vipers because combo breakers and various other aspects of the game don't allow for it. VF2 is more of a button bashers dream than FV. No matter how expertly skilled you are VF2 you can easily fall victim to a newbies variation of a PPK combo than you can on FV.
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Post by The Elite MYT on May 18, 2017 13:34:59 GMT
I´m with Fighting Vipers. I find the roster for VF2 extremely boring.
Not played Virtual On so really can´t provide any comment there
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Post by bultje112 on May 18, 2017 13:47:59 GMT
the thing is in fighting vipers. anyone could pick up the controller and be able to win battles. in virtua fighter 2 any noob will get schooled by cpu and experienced players. But that's the thing. It is actually the exact opposite. Button bashers and noobs will and can easily win battles on VF2 because the game mechanics allow for it. You can't get away with winning via fluke on Fighting Vipers because combo breakers and various other aspets of the game don't allow for it. VF2 is more of a button bashers dream than FV. No matter how expertly skilled you are VF2 you can easily fall victim to a newbies variation of a PPK combo than you can on FV.that's not true at all. only if you suck at virtua fighter can that happen. otherwise no change.
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sych
"Living for the fantasy" -NIGHTS INTO DREAMS- The Classic Saturn Gem!!!
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Post by sych on May 18, 2017 14:10:26 GMT
Only 15 votes anyway. Either way, Fighting Vipers is much more of a casual fighting game. It's understandable it comes out on top on these kind of poles I actually feel Fighting Vipers is slower paced. VF2 is just much more technical. To be proficient in VF (in general) isn't an easy task at all so it feels a bit slower but, in fact, the problem is with the player and not the game : p It's things like that make Fighting Vipers more technical than VF2. If I'm playing VF2 I know I'll attack Sarah, Jacky, Lau, Lion and Shun exactly the same way to achieve the same success. It's only when playing countering Akira and cheating Dural that I have to change up my tactics. But that's mainly down to the AI not fighting fairly. Don't take it in the wrong way, but this statement is screaming "casual" gamer - and that's just fine. The only way you'll have success in Virtua Fighter (in general, not only the 2nd) is adapting to the various match-ups. Sure, if you play solo or agains't a couple of friends you might feel everything works in the same way as opposed to Fighting Vipers. Meaning: Fighting Vipers has a better AI (eventually) and the use of weapons might feel like it's easier to interpret what's happening on screen. For ages, Virtua Fighter franchise was the most technical 3D fighting game's franchise and everything just used VF2 concepts in order to create new IPs or adapting existing ones. Even Tekken eventually started using Virtua Fighter's juggling properties to perform combos (not those "10-hit combos" you could find in the command list - i'm talking about TRUE combos). I could go on and on and on... I've been entering fighting games tournaments since i was 19 (i'm 27 now), i've met hundreds of players, travelled abroad just to enter in tournaments and only a tiny little fraction played Virtua Fighter competitively due to its complexity. [/quote] I've elaborated in great detail why I believe Fighting Vipers is anything but casual. The armour mechanics justifies this alone as its not something you find in the majority of Fighting games. No offence but how do my comments scream "casual gamer" when I've been more specific in my feedback about in game gameplay than you have about VF2? Explain this term 'True Combo' and what qualifies a technique as a true combo and which characters in VF2 pull these off? Quoting data on VF2's production history or listing tournaments won is totally irrelevant to the discussion at hand. Give me an indepth example in the actual gameplay mechanics of a character situation to back up this statements. You say you can go on and on but again no offence nothing that you have remotely said has justified any of your statements. However, its not that serious. Its good to be debating on this level, shows passion. When it comes to Fighting games, that's probably my strongest genre of game. And I tend to play solo against the AI in VF2 as opposed to with friends. Like I said the same method of play I adapt will floor 80% of AI characters in VF2 as they all fall for the same tricks.
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dantemdie
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Post by dantemdie on May 18, 2017 14:12:30 GMT
the thing is in fighting vipers. anyone could pick up the controller and be able to win battles. in virtua fighter 2 any noob will get schooled by cpu and experienced players. But that's the thing. It is actually the exact opposite. Button bashers and noobs will and can easily win battles on VF2 because the game mechanics allow for it. You can't get away with winning via fluke on Fighting Vipers because combo breakers and various other aspets of the game don't allow for it. VF2 is more of a button bashers dream than FV. No matter how expertly skilled you are VF2 you can easily fall victim to a newbies variation of a PPK combo than you can on FV. There are no flukes agains't a good or even agains't a decent VF player. Speaking of combos: www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGaXvwYd_98Try to do half of these if you can. Because i don't and i have thousands of hours playing fighting games lol
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sych
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Post by sych on May 18, 2017 14:29:01 GMT
But that's the thing. It is actually the exact opposite. Button bashers and noobs will and can easily win battles on VF2 because the game mechanics allow for it. You can't get away with winning via fluke on Fighting Vipers because combo breakers and various other aspets of the game don't allow for it. VF2 is more of a button bashers dream than FV. No matter how expertly skilled you are VF2 you can easily fall victim to a newbies variation of a PPK combo than you can on FV.that's not true at all. only if you suck at virtua fighter can that happen. otherwise no change. You're missing the point. It's not a true or false statement its a factual part of the game mechanics. Its not about "sucking" at a game. It's about stating what IS. Once started, PPK can't be broken with any character unless with a character that counters. Even then its a guessing game with the counterer as to which section the 'K' lands on as each counterstrike requires a slightly different direction press on the dpad. Repettitive PPK combo on FV can't be tolerated as easy because of combo breakers.
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sych
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Post by sych on May 18, 2017 14:38:57 GMT
But that's the thing. It is actually the exact opposite. Button bashers and noobs will and can easily win battles on VF2 because the game mechanics allow for it. You can't get away with winning via fluke on Fighting Vipers because combo breakers and various other aspets of the game don't allow for it. VF2 is more of a button bashers dream than FV. No matter how expertly skilled you are VF2 you can easily fall victim to a newbies variation of a PPK combo than you can on FV. There are no flukes agains't a good or even agains't a decent VF player. Speaking of combos: www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGaXvwYd_98Try to do half of these if you can. Because i don't and i have thousands of hours playing fighting games lol Most of those Akira combinations I've done before and are easily done and aren't infact that effective because they can be stopped simply by the opponent blocking. Only 2 of those I clocked were unbreakable combos. Great combinations all the same though. Its always feels great to use Akira but I'm much more fluid with Kage. He's my secret weapon. My thoughts about the gameplay aside, I am in agreement that Virtua Fighter 2 is an incredible game but it does have it's faults. As I mentioned in another thread, even though VF2 and Last Bronx were PAL optimized, they're even better to play at 60hz
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Post by pocketpocket on May 19, 2017 0:57:15 GMT
Surprised that Virtua Fighter 2 is in last place, I thought it was widely considered the Saturn's killer app!
I'd lean towards Fighting Vipers as well though. Just a bit faster and with a crazier roster. Virtual On I never really got to grips with, it really throws you in the deep end and doesn't explain itself too well, I struggle to defeat even Stage 3 and 4, and Stage 5 just isn't happening any time soon. I'm not going to vote yet because I want to give Virtual On a bit more of a chance (preferably with the twin sticks because those look amazing), but until then Fighting Vipers is my favourite.
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